Talk:Tutorial:First Steps

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Needs Updates

This page needs some serious reworking, especially since I imagine it is one of the more frequented pages on the wiki. Stuff like Kinetic and Heat power aren't even in here. I can see people are probably a little sentimental about the photos from Beta 1.4, but that was four years ago (March 2011) and the information in that Wind Power section (which I just removed) literally hasn't been updated since it was first added July 28, 2012. --Max Shen (talk) 07:05, 28 February 2015 (CET)

It's hard to update this beyond what the wiki has. For example, the wiki still lists the information for Wind Mill that you just deleted, along with Youtube videos from 2012 and 2013. I did a major update last summer to bring it up to experimental, but I didn't remove any old pics. Updates to this guide pretty much have to be made to the main wiki first. If you know enough to update the Wind Mill page, that would be great. Then we could add the new version to this guide. I would add Kinetic and Heat power, but I don't know how they work myself. I don't really see how they add anything over electricity, but then again I haven't tried it. If you want to write something up, I'd be happy to edit it, if needed. I'll try to find some time to mess around with the new version of the mod, but by the time I catch up there'll probably be another major revision. --Trifler (talk) 08:29, 28 February 2015 (CET)

Alternative Power

Ok I took a good look at the new Wind Generator and the Heat stuff. I definitely don't like the durability times for the rotors, especially of the wood ones, since they're the only ones you can make from a renewable resource. It looks like the Heat stuff is mostly about making Refined Iron, so it probably doesn't need to be in a First Steps guide, unless more stuff is added later. The Stirling Engine is kind of weird because if you hook up a solid or liquid heat generator to a Stirling Engine, you've basically created a two-block Generator. Have to see how efficient it is I suppose. I can work on adding a Kinetic Wind Generator with a wooden rotor. If they make the Heat stuff a little more interesting I might add a refined iron rotor later. The regular iron rotor seems like a waste. --Trifler (talk) 10:13, 28 February 2015 (CET)

Actually, they are all renewable even without replication. Obviously wood and iron are renewable (iron from Ferru, Golems, Zombies). Refined Iron requires iron, Compressed Air Cells (you get the cells back), and heat (which can be generated greenly). If you're really going to put in the effort, the Slag byproduct of refining iron actually can be centrifuged to make a renewable source of Coal Dust, or make a Wither Skeleton farm on top of the Nether. I'll try and update more of the wiki, too.--Max Shen (talk) 13:34, 28 February 2015 (CET)
Do you know how to make an Iron Shaft? It hasn't been added to the wiki yet, and no version of the Kinetic Wind Generator can be built without it. Also, do you know if the Manual Kinetic Generator is working yet? I see it listed on the Recipes page. --Trifler (talk) 16:37, 2 March 2015 (CET)
You make the Shaft (Iron) in a Metal Former by extruding an Iron Block. The Manual Kinetic Generator works perfectly, it generates 100 EU per action (right click) when connected to a Kinetic Generator. I get ~15EU/t by standing there holding the right mouse button.--Max Shen (talk) 17:40, 4 March 2015 (CET)
Cool. Thx. :) --Trifler (talk) 05:49, 5 March 2015 (CET)
Added. --Trifler (talk) 07:43, 5 March 2015 (CET)
The Manual Kinetic Generator itself produces kU (kinetic units), not EU. That is why it needs a Kinetic Generator to be attached to produce that 100 EU I was talking about.--Max Shen (talk) 23:45, 5 March 2015 (CET)
I saw on the forums that steam generation is not intended to be used to produce EU (it results in a net loss, with the exception of using waste heat from a reactor). I saw a post that mentioned using steam for the early game, but not what for. If it is useful in the early game, I need to know if it should go in this guide. Do you know what is it intended for? --Trifler (talk) 07:43, 5 March 2015 (CET)
Steam could never be early game. Mid game maybe to make distilled water for overclockers, but it's designed for the 5x5 reactors. Chocohead NagAdditions 17:12, 5 March 2015 (CET)

Note that the Kinetic Steam Generator requires blast iron casings, so this disqualifies steam power from earlygame.--Max Shen (talk) 23:45, 5 March 2015 (CET)

A valient attempt :P Just a few things I must correct:
1. Changing the water input rate on the steam generator doesn't make it bug out, it just makes it require more heat. So, normally, it takes 100hU to get 1mb of water to 100°C. Setting it to 2 makes it require 200hU. Changing the pressure also affects the heat requirement though, so you probably saw these effects stacking. If it doesn't get enough heat, it goes funky.
2. Steam can be put in a condenser to get distilled water. This also stops steam explosions, which is nice, as suddenly you're not relying on 1000000 solar distillers to get your distilled water for you steam setup.
3. Superheated steam can be sent back through a turbine, as it comes out as normal steam (from the 1st one). Hence 200 bar at 1/2mb is the best setup for maximum power out of the steam.
4. Never power a steam generator off an electric heat generator. You're throwing power away with the inefficiency. If you don't have any lava or hot coolant though, it might be your only option. Just don't rely on it if you're trying for a net gain of power.
5. The ratio is always 1:100 water/distilled water:steam/superheated steam. The pressure has no effect on this.
6. The steam generator can accept heat from any side. Not sure if you mentioned that, but it can.
7. It's refined iron, not blast iron :P
Chocohead NagAdditions 00:20, 6 March 2015 (CET)
I didn't even think to put another turbine after the first! OK, now how about a couple questions from me?
  1. How does the pressure affect the heat requirement? I've tried multiple configurations, for example 2mB/t at 0 bar with 300hU/t still makes the output type flash between water and steam, the temperature does not stabilize, etc.
  2. How do you set the Kinetic Steam Generator to take in 1/2mB/t? A Fluid Regulator with the dial set to 10mB/s?
--Max Shen (talk) 01:37, 6 March 2015 (CET)
1. Pressure increases the heat requirement by a bit per bar. It's less than 1, as 0 bar at 1 mb/t is 100hU, while 220 bar at 1 mb/t is 200hU.
2. There'd not really be any reason to limit what a kinetic steam generator is given steam wise, since Steam is otherwise useless (unless you're converting it all into distilled water using condensers), you should try and put all of it into the kinetic steam generator to avoid steam explosions.
Chocohead NagEditsAdmin 01:43, 21 March 2015 (CET)
I seem to have messed up the indentation with those spoilers, sorry. If anyone can fix that, please do... :S --Max Shen (talk) 21:52, 25 March 2015 (CET)

Biofuel

Now that I've gotten into it, Biofuel is a very good alternative energy source. It requires a bit of infrastructure, but the infrastructure is all Tier 1 (LV) while being fully renewable and later automated.

   Biochaff + Water in left tank -(Fluid/Solid Canning Machine)-> Biomass -(Fermenter)-> Biofuel -(Fluid Distributor)-> at least two Fluid Generators, one for the Fermenter and one for a Stirling Engine

Well, I think it could be done before having an MFE. With Crop-Harvesters the process could definitely be fully automated.--Max Shen (talk) 21:52, 25 March 2015 (CET)

It could easily done before an MFE. MFEs cost 16 diamonds, getting enough iron and a way to produce biomass is a lot easier than that. Chocohead NagEditsAdmin 23:57, 25 March 2015 (CET)